Full transcript: Alex Houlston — BOOM!: electrifying Australia's residential and commercial properties
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This is an automated transcript of the episode, lightly edited for readability. Please excuse any errors.
Alex Houlston: Thanks, Kylie. Thanks for having us.
Kylie Davis: It's great to have you here. Now, our first question's always the hardest, Alex. What is the Boomm Power, uh, elevator pitch?
Alex Houlston: Uh, so Boomm is Australia's leading building electrification platform. Uh, we make it easy to make the switch.
Kylie Davis: Awesome. So really wanna pull this apart, 'cause I know energy efficiency in homes is such a big issue right now. Tell us a little bit more detail about how you do what you're doing.
Alex Houlston: Yeah, so Boomm, uh, Boomm is a climate tech business. You know, it delivers on electrification needs all within one platform. So it's purpose-built software that simplifies that building electrification process, eliminates all the complexity and uncertainty, um, makes a seamless and effortless decision-making process, and, um, and able to find reliable suppliers, assess, and attract- track your environmental and financial impacts.
Kylie Davis: Okay. So is it for existing homes, or is it for new homes, or both?
Alex Houlston: I- it's for existing buildings.
Kylie Davis: Excellent. Okay. So it might not just be homes. It could also be-
Alex Houlston: Yes
Kylie Davis: ... office blocks or anything, retail-
Alex Houlston: Yeah, we f-
Kylie Davis: ... industrial?
Alex Houlston: Yeah, we focus on the hard-to-reach markets, so-
Kylie Davis: Right
Alex Houlston: ... homes are the first, because households are what we know best.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, but uh, yeah, increasingly SMEs in particular, where it's really hard to actually get, uh, traction with, uh, with building business owners, um, who, yeah, just don't have the time or energy to, um, to understand what they should be doing.
Kylie Davis: Okay. Awesome. So why is this a problem? How big is the problem? Why do we need to electrify our homes and our, and our SMEs?
Alex Houlston: Well, if we're gonna reach zero emissions, and we'd hope to do it, everyone's saying 2050, but I would've thought 2030 was a better goal, um-
Kylie Davis: A much better goal We do not need to be locked into-
Alex Houlston: You know-
Kylie Davis: ... old government promises.
Alex Houlston: No, exactly. Yeah, so-
Kylie Davis: Kicking the can down that road.
Alex Houlston: Yeah. I mean, um, yeah, so if we assume that it was going to happen by 2050, let's say-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, um, then, um, then the, the grid is increasingly renewable, uh, which means that we're gonna end up with most of our emissions coming from the gas appliances with-
Kylie Davis: True
Alex Houlston: ... within our homes and businesses. And, uh, if we just look at the household market, um, that would mean retrofitting 50 homes every hour, every working hour, let's say eight hours a day, um, between now and 2050. So you can imagine-
Kylie Davis: Oh my God
Alex Houlston: ... if we, if we crunch that um, then to 10 years, um, yes, it, uh, becomes a much bigger goal, a much bigger, um, much bigger problem.
Kylie Davis: And 50 homes and, uh, 50 homes an hour, did you say?
Alex Houlston: Mm. It's just a 30.
Kylie Davis: Wow. Just to... So this is getting people off gas and converting over to electricity?
Alex Houlston: Yes.
Kylie Davis: Wow. So what's our rate at the moment? How good or bad are we at this right now? Do we know?
Alex Houlston: That's, that's a good question. I, uh, don't know that.
Kylie Davis: That is-
Alex Houlston: Yeah, there was-
Kylie Davis: This is one of the great joys of Australian property ownership. It's one of the invisible pieces of data that, that nobody knows just yet, right?
Alex Houlston: Yes. I mean-
Kylie Davis: Okay
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, even, yeah, I mean, even the banks, for example, you know, valuation companies, that sort of thing.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: We don't really have a handle on, um, what's happening out there.
Kylie Davis: Right
Alex Houlston: ... um, because there's no one single repository for that kind of information.
Kylie Davis: No.
Alex Houlston: You know? It's mainly done by tradies, contractors out there replacing-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... appliances within homes, and that's-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... the way it's done.
Kylie Davis: Okay. Wow, okay. And this is something that, um... There's this weird coincidence that happens in the PropTech Podcast. Maybe it's not a coincidence. Maybe it is because I'm talking to you guys and you, and you inspire me so much. But we are currently looking at introducing solar power to our house because the reason why is 'cause I wanna change all our appliances off gas to electric.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: And so-
Alex Houlston: It's a great start
Kylie Davis: ... but it is hard. It's hard. It's a hard thing to do. And I, I interviewed recently, uh, Alice Todd from, uh, Val AI, and then also Sonia Markovic from, um, Evertat.
Alex Houlston: Mm-hmm.
Kylie Davis: And, and Sonia explained it beautifully by saying trying to do this stuff feels like doing a PhD sometimes. And I was like, "All the feels." Like, yep, totally. So, so how do, how does Boom Power... Is it Boom Power or just Boom, or how are we-
Alex Houlston: Uh, Boom
Kylie Davis: ... what are we calling you?
Alex Houlston: Boom.
Kylie Davis: Boom? Okay. So how do you guys make that easy, and what do I need to do?
Alex Houlston: So for a household, our business is B2B2C. So it's a-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... white label platform.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Um, so for a household, you'd use our consumer facing calculator, calculators to, uh, to really easily work out, you know, what's the best cost benefit in your house. Our, um... I mean, for me, for example, I am... I've been in this house for three years and, um, and so we have done the, we've done the solar. You're right.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: You should do the solar first, um, s- because then you can replace those electric appliances and use the, the power from your roof.
Kylie Davis: Yes.
Alex Houlston: Um, you then... So we've done the heating and cooling, and EV charger, and the stove top.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Now, still got instant hot water left. Now, I'm three years in-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... and I'm pretty passionate about it.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: So you can imagine if you're a consumer using that calculator, the, uh, the Boom front end, that, um, yeah, you're probably not gonna do everything at once, particularly if you're, you know, living in Victoria, for example, where there is predominantly gas appliances.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, so you can always go back to that calculator to work out what's next. But, but how you'd use it is... So there are about 32 different combinations of appliances. And for example, Kylie, if you do solar plus hot water to start with, that's gonna have a very different cost benefit for you compared to doing solar with your heating and cooling.
Kylie Davis: Right.
Alex Houlston: Not just doing solar on its own.
Kylie Davis: Okay.
Alex Houlston: And uh, you know, because there are... You can use those two things together.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Um, but, um, so there are about 32 different combinations of products that the platform calculates. Sounds very complicated, but what we do is turn really sophisticated energy modeling into something simple, that you can then go, okay, well, what if I don't do that? What impact does that have on my cost benefit? It's, um, you then make a decision. Uh, it links you to suppliers, um, through our marketplace. Uh, Boom's a marketplace platform. And, um, so you can then select which suppliers you want to install the products. Um, and then we gather data from devices, like solar inverters or, uh, metering devices to, um, to support you throughout that journey of electrification, which, you know, as I say, I'm three years in. Could be, could be 10 years for a lot of households.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: And when you get to the end of 10 years, that hot water system may stop working.
Kylie Davis: Yeah, that's true, true.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: It might be time for it to be replaced anyway.
Alex Houlston: Yes.
Kylie Davis: But, um, there is so much in this. So we know from, from the conversations we've been having with, with, um, with Val AI and, and with Evertat, there's, what, 12 million properties in Australia, and about 78% to 80% are existing homes that are-
Alex Houlston: Yeah
Kylie Davis: ... older than, what, 1980 or '85 or something, something like that.
Alex Houlston: Yeah. Okay.
Kylie Davis: So, so these are the properties in our property ecosystem that need to be upgraded in terms of energy efficiency because they're probably a two star out of seven star rating. What... How big a challenge is this? How, how, how much does a typ-... I mean, 32 thir- you know, 32 variations that you could, that you could have. But how do you... What are the savings that you're going to be making, or, or what's the cost that you're looking at, or the investment that you're looking at in moving a typical two-star family home over from gas heating, gas, uh, hot water, and maybe a gas stove over to, to being electric?
Alex Houlston: So it depends.
Kylie Davis: Yeah, of course it does.
Alex Houlston: Every, every household is different. Um, but, um, if we ignore, um, EV-
Kylie Davis: Let's a-... Yep.
Alex Houlston: When you're looking at-
Kylie Davis: Let's assume, let's assume a nuclear family, so mom and dad-
Alex Houlston: Yeah
Kylie Davis: ... and two kids. Yep.
Alex Houlston: And, um, yeah, we at the moment for... Because we're, um, yeah, we're a bootstraps company-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... uh, to date until, until, uh, this year. Um, and so we've always built out what customers want, um, and what they're asking for.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: And, uh, what people are asking for so far is electrification.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Whereas the star rating to date-
Kylie Davis: Yes
Alex Houlston: ... um, uh, you know, is mainly influenced by the building envelope, as in-
Kylie Davis: Right
Alex Houlston: ... insulation and windows and, um-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... and the outside. So, um, for us, the... Yeah, you're looking at somewhere between 10 and 20,000 for-
Kylie Davis: Mm
Alex Houlston: ... full electrification of the building. It's kind of aligns with where the banks are looking at. I think it's CBA, um, with their green loan that's about 30,000 available.
Kylie Davis: Right.
Alex Houlston: Um, which, yeah, is probably, um, yeah, at the higher end for-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... what would be at the higher end for most households.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. Okay. So b- so electrification and energy efficiency, not the same thing, but over l- that, but like obviously there's a, I feel a Venn diagram coming on, right? That
Alex Houlston: Yes.
Kylie Davis: There definitely, there's definitely quite a big overlap in it. I mean, I, I want it because I want an induction stove because I have a stove top coffee pot, and it's just so much faster than-
Alex Houlston: Oh, yeah
Kylie Davis: ... doing it on gas.
Alex Houlston: Makes sense.
Kylie Davis: So this is my s- This is the Kylie Davis complete, uh, vested interest in electrification.
Alex Houlston: And it's also, it's also energy efficient.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, and electrification is energy efficient because your-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... the, uh, coefficient of a, uh, hot water system, for example, is far greater than, um, than a, than a gas system. You know, your, as in, you know, the, um, yeah, the cost you'll pay for-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... the hot water, which is what you want, um-
Kylie Davis: Yes
Alex Houlston: ... is far less for the electric than, than gas with a heat pump.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. So, so Alex, tell me the story. How did you guys, uh, now your co-founders are Tosh and, and David.
Alex Houlston: Yes.
Kylie Davis: David Perry and, and Tosh Shattown. How did you guys get into this?
Alex Houlston: Well, um, Tosh and I met about 11 years ago. Um, and I was, uh, I was working for the state government on, um, big housing redevelopments.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Mainly focused on the sustainability aspects. Um, so, uh, I was also working on energy performance contracts in the high-rise buildings for public housing. And I'd spent three years setting up an energy services company, um, which we, we just signed the heads of agreement. It was focused on three precincts, um, in Carlton. And, um, and it'd taken three years when for me, you know, probably should've been 12 months.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, so to be honest, uh, I'd got to the point where I was feeling a little frustrated-... after five, five years of, um, of, uh, yeah, we had action. But, um, but yeah, it should've been s- it was, should've been a lot quicker. Um, and, um, so I, I met Tosh at a point where I was thinking, well, you know, maybe I, whether we're better off going out and doing this in the private sector or, you know, helping, um, community housing. It was, um, was my first-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... thought because, um, yeah, I'd worked in the public, public-private redevelopments. Um-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... and Tosh, Tosh was at the CSIRO. Um, he, you know, he's been there about two years from memory, and um, and was feeling equally frustrated, um, about the fact that, uh, you know, he was having to do business development and bring in research dollars when he felt like those research dollars might be better off spent on putting solar on rooftops.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, so he was, um, writing a, a report called The Intelligent Grid, which was all about the business models for distributed energy across the country.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: And, um, and so, yeah, his, he could do, still can, um, a business case, you know, using a spreadsheet within half an hour.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: That some, that would take most people a week or like-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... you know, for days. Um, so, and given that I'd done the procurement of, you know, large scale projects and then project management, and he'd done the upfront modeling. We thought, well, collectively we could go out and replace all of those shiny consulting reports that end up s- stuck on shelves because people don't know what to do with them.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Um, or don't have the time to actually implement and, um, and help them to actually implement projects based on really good insights. So, um, so we set up a consulting firm and, yeah, it became really quickly to us, um, that, uh, sorry. Quick- became very obvious to us quite quickly that, um, that the best way to scale up that impact was through software.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, took us a few years to find David Perry. Um-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... because to be honest, I don't know, I've still haven't met anybody else that has David's in-depth knowledge of energy, um, you know, in terms of the financials, but also a very technical point of view. He's an electrical engineer with a PhD in neuroscience, taught himself to code. So someone who has that deep energy knowledge, who knows how to build software, I'm still looking. Kylie, if you know anyone.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. Wow.
Alex Houlston: We can bring them back up. And we won't, you know.
Kylie Davis: I love it. I love that he's got a back- I love that he's got a background in both engineering and neuroscience. That's pretty unexpected, right?
Alex Houlston: Yeah, it is.
Kylie Davis: But also kind of-
Alex Houlston: Well-
Kylie Davis: ... um, helpful in, I g- well your brain's made up of electrical impulses. Maybe it's not.
Alex Houlston: Yeah. Okay.
Kylie Davis: Maybe it's not. Yeah. Um.
Alex Houlston: I think that makes sense. When I, I thought about it af- you know, obviously I've thought about it. We've been working together for six, six years now, I think.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: And, um, and the, uh, there's quite a lot of coding in electrical engineering, apparently.
Kylie Davis: Yes. Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Who knows?
Kylie Davis: Who knew?
Alex Houlston: Um.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: So, so that kind of translates into coding for neuroscience and-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... um, he has explained, um, a few things to me over the years and, uh, I think it was, uh, I think it's Richard Branson that says, "Always employ people who are, who are more intelligent than you."
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: So I've, I managed to find business partners who are more intelligent than me, which is a great thing.
Kylie Davis: Fantastic. I wanna stick him and Sarah Bell on a panel and just let them go.
Alex Houlston: Yeah, do.
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Alex Houlston: Well, yeah-
Kylie Davis: ... you know, the current
Alex Houlston: ... I think technically we, so incorporated Boom, uh, six years ago as a separate company.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: We cannibalized all of the consulting customers we had back then.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, but, um, yeah, b- with, with COVID, um, realistically the platform's been live for about two and a half to three years.
Kylie Davis: Right. Okay. And you ment- you mentioned before that you've just got a seed round or you're in the process of locking your seed l- round in.
Alex Houlston: Yes.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: This week, um-
Kylie Davis: Yep
Alex Houlston: ... we're, we're getting final offers, yeah.
Kylie Davis: Yes. Fabulous. And so what will that let you do?
Alex Houlston: Uh, so that's... Well, it's still focused, um, for the time being, less than, at least the next 12 years, uh, 12 years 12 months on the Australian market. Um, what it's allowing us to do is, um, so actually, sorry, I should go back. Um, so we actually, um, signed a SAFE with Boundless Earth, um, towards the end of last year. Um, that was focused on them providing catalytic funding to focus the platform on the banking sector. So we're now, we're launching with Bank Australia in three weeks time.
Kylie Davis: Oh.
Alex Houlston: Um, so they will have that consumer-facing calculator that'll allow their mortgage loan book customers to electrify their homes.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, so the, the investment that's coming is also focused on, uh, Boom being utilized by the banking sector. And, um, yeah, so we're in the, um, uh, yeah, very late stages of a partnership that will give us direct access in there and, um, and so the funding that will come alongside it is, uh, yeah, very much focused on enabling the banks or the mort... I should say mortgage lenders, um, to help their mortgage loan book customers effectively, um, dealing with their financed emissions, scope 3 emissions.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. So we, we're seeing this all across the, the funding or the finance sector, aren't we? That, um, banks and I guess insurance companies too are kind of desperate-
Alex Houlston: Mm
Kylie Davis: ... to understand what's the climate risk sitting inside their portfolios and, um, and carbon risk. So you said before that your model was B2B2C. Is this like a kind of example of that model? So Bank Australia is going to have a, a, a, a Boom-powered, um, calculator available for its customers?
Alex Houlston: Yes-
Kylie Davis: Yes?
Alex Houlston: ... in a way.
Kylie Davis: Or in a way.
Alex Houlston: I- ironically, um, simply because of their own approach to risk and governance, it will actually be Boom branded in this case.
Kylie Davis: Oh, okay.
Alex Houlston: Um, which-
Kylie Davis: Fine. That's all right
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, yeah. So it is what it is. And, um, yeah-
Kylie Davis: Who are we to question the banking sector?
Alex Houlston: Um, and yeah, and they're an awesome organization. We're really excited to work with Bank Australia because they, you know, they actually probably, um- Pretty unique in that they have a very public target for their 2035 net zero emissions-
Kylie Davis: Yes
Alex Houlston: ... um, target. And, um, and so, yeah, for them the, the, the risk mainly was around, um, the s- recommending particular suppliers. And, um, you know, and we, we have a long history of, uh, of probity and procurement, um, competitive procurement built into the platform. Um, so it's... We've had about, I think, around $12 million worth of projects, um, procured directly through Booom. And, um, and so, yeah, they were very comfortable with our approach to competitive procurement and probity so they, we can recommend the suppliers as a Booom branded version. So, um, but yes, the idea would always be in future there's B2B2C, and it may well be for Bank Australia in future too, but, uh.
Kylie Davis: Okay.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: And so if I am not a Bank Australia customer and/or... How can I use the Booom platform? Is there a way-
Alex Houlston: You-
Kylie Davis: Is there just a B2C?
Alex Houlston: You can't, I'm afraid, at the moment.
Kylie Davis: I can't. Oh, no.
Alex Houlston: Uh-
Kylie Davis: All this electrification. I, I have a coffee that needs urgent boiling Alex.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: Help me out here.
Alex Houlston: Oh, I'm sure I could help you if you like. You wanna, you wanna set up half an hour with the... I said 10 minutes. Yes.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: You can, uh, you can be a beta customer. We've, uh-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, we've been doing some pretty stringent beta testing over the last, uh, couple of months. You've just missed it-
Kylie Davis: Oh
Alex Houlston: ... but I'm sure I can-
Kylie Davis: Damn
Alex Houlston: ... get one of my developers to go through it with you.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. Okay. Um, so I need to f- I need to be banking with someone, or I need to be using one of your B2B2C-
Alex Houlston: Yes
Kylie Davis: ... platforms. Yeah?
Alex Houlston: You will need to, yes, in future.
Kylie Davis: I will need to. Okay.
Alex Houlston: And, um, I mean, uh-
Kylie Davis: But-
Alex Houlston: Sorry, go on
Kylie Davis: ... is Bank Australia the first one to come on board, or are they, are there others out there?
Alex Houlston: Bank Australia's the first bank.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Um, we cover about 80% of the social housing market in Victoria, for example. Um, so-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... they, they were our first customer type.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Um, so yeah, the two largest housing associations in the country, for example, um, use Booom to assess their portfolios for electrification opportunities.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: They then procure products through the platform, and then we get, they gather data from, yeah, metering devices and solar inverters where their tenants allow to, um, to give them an aggregated picture of the portfolio. Which is, which is similar to, to banks. You know, we, um... I guess it took us probably longer than we realized, uh, or longer than it should have, to realize that, um, a mortgage loan book is a property portfolio just like a residential landlord. Um, so for, for a bank, they want to treat it as a property portfolio and, um, and get those insights on the impacts they've had to avoid greenwashing. Um, so Booom gives them that transparency over the impacts of, uh, from a financial and environmental point of view.
Kylie Davis: Okay. So what's, what... You've, you've just, you're in the process of securing your sort of seed funding. You've got a big customer about to come on board. What, what else is on your roadmap? How are you guys rolling out?
Alex Houlston: Um, so we will, yeah, we will be focused on the banking sector over the next 12 to 18 months.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Um, that's, um, yeah, become our sort of beachhead. Uh, that term's quite new to me. In the la- last couple of months I heard it through-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... Climate-KIC.
Kylie Davis: Well-
Alex Houlston: The beachhead customer segment
Kylie Davis: ... you were saying before that things took too long, but I mean, pro- this is where proptech and property are very, very similar. Like, where, you know, like it always takes- Whenever you're building or renovating it always takes, you know, twice as long and twice as much money than you thought it was going to.
Alex Houlston: That's right.
Kylie Davis: And, and, and so it is in proptech as well often I find. Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: So it's, yep.
Alex Houlston: Yeah, no, it's interesting. It, like, you're right. I mean, it's tech trying to deal with, uh, physical, you know, tangible things.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: And, um, yeah, I guess that's where we're, um, yeah, where our unique value proposition comes really is that, uh, yeah, bu- being able to build the software but understand, um, the retrofitting and, um, and that process of actually, um, yeah, what it takes to, um, to retrofit homes. And, um, and that's, that's the impact. You know, that's our mission is to, um, is to electrify, you know, all, every, all, every home in the world, um-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... or every b- every building. And, um, and yeah, we know how to do that. And so, um, it's, uh, yeah, it's all built into the software.
Kylie Davis: So, so what's coming up on your, in your model? Like, what's your rolling out looking like?
Alex Houlston: Um, so, um, yeah, the-
Kylie Davis: Beachheading with banking. Yep.
Alex Houlston: So yeah. Sorry. That's right. Um, so yeah, the beachhead will be with the banks. Um, we have, uh, similar, so adjacent sectors to the home lending, um, home lending sector.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Um, but also, um, places like local government where we know already that the banks are keen to be able to provide financing. Be-
Kylie Davis: Mm
Alex Houlston: ... in the end, you know, banks just want to sell money. Um-
Kylie Davis: Yes. It's, uh-
Alex Houlston: That's what, what they're there for
Kylie Davis: ... and, and, and their, and that makes the world go round. Yep.
Alex Houlston: Yes. Yeah, so they're very... You know, the, the banks are there. They want to provide finance. And for, you know, as, as trusted intermediary is that local government sector. So, um, so they-
Kylie Davis: I, I now wanna go and interview a whole bunch of banks to see who gives me the elevator pitch of, "We sell money." That's awesome, Alex. I'm remembering that. Yep.
Alex Houlston: The... Yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm betting that precisely zero of them will-
Kylie Davis: Yes
Alex Houlston: ... yes, but-
Kylie Davis: I'll get a whole lot of corporate speak, but no, but that's what we do. We sell money. It's good. And look, it's, it's perfectly okay. Yep. Sorry.
Alex Houlston: Yeah, I mean-
Kylie Davis: Got distracted
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, it's, I mean, they, um... Yeah, so that, that local government and, and banking ma- makes sense for us because they're, you know, they're, um, channels to market for each other in a way.
Kylie Davis: Yes.
Alex Houlston: Um, you know, the, the councils want to provide, um, low cost finance to their constituents to enable, you know, their net zero targets or climate emergency declarations, and, um, and the banks want to provide money. Um, and, um, and so they're both, um, trusted intermediaries to an extent. You know, there's always variations on that. Um, but, um, yeah, it's, they're, they're pretty trusted by the public- On the whole
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: So, um, so they make sense for us, um, to, yeah, con- um, conflen- con- what's the word? Uh...
Kylie Davis: Well, it's kinda like top-down, bottom-up, right? Because the banks are sorta coming from the top down with the money, and the councils have got the grassroots kind of bottom up.
Alex Houlston: Yeah
Kylie Davis: So that, that makes com- that makes complete sense.
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: Um, how big are you guys now at the moment? 'Cause you're still pretty fledgling, but...
Alex Houlston: Uh, there's a team of eight.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Uh, so yeah, there's eight of us. We're s- split across, um, Victoria, New South Wales, and Jakarta. Our, um, our marketing person, Carla, is, uh, is in Jakarta.
Kylie Davis: Mm.
Alex Houlston: Um, she, yeah, she joined us... She's actually our first staff member, I think, apart from the founders. Yes.
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: She would've been. Um, and, um, yeah, was, uh, had just finished studying in Melbourne at the time. But sadly, you know, we couldn't work out the visas, so, uh, she's been back in Jakarta for about 18 months.
Kylie Davis: Okay. And what's been the biggest challenge... What's been your biggest challenge so far?
Alex Houlston: Um, oh, I think the, the biggest challenge is always, um, data distribution-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... dollars.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: Um, actually getting a hold of-
Kylie Davis: The three Ds.
Alex Houlston: Yeah. Uh, yeah.
Kylie Davis: Another Venn diagram.
Alex Houlston: It would be a good one, actually. I like that one. Um, yeah, with data, like, getting a hold of, uh, tangible data, yeah-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... there's... We can... We make a lot of assumptions. We, you know, we have had to, particularly in, um, places like social housing where we started, you know, um, you would think that most organizations would have a really good handle on what they own and what condition it's in. But unfortunately that, in a lot of cases, that's not the case.
Kylie Davis: No.
Alex Houlston: Um, so but it... And it's a similar in the mass market residential, you know. And, um, uh, even in the banking sector it seems that a lot of the time they don't... Sometimes they don't know they have a mortgage on a particular property.
Kylie Davis: Mm.
Alex Houlston: And, um, and that's not Bank Australia in particular. That's just, um, yeah, that's what we, what we hear quite a bit. Um, and then distribution, I mean, from a... as a B2B2C platform, um, we... the right partnerships are, um, are one of the, um, the hardest things to, um, to lo- to lock in and make decisions about. Um, so we have a partnership, for example, with Optima Technology, who until recently they were ASX-listed. Um, they, um... And so yeah, we use a, a little bit of their data, their parsing software to-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... grab information out, out of bills, you know, tariff information out of bills-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... for our SME, um, SME, um, projects. Um, and then data distribution and dollars. Yeah, and dollars we think we're gonna have resolved pretty soon. But, um, yeah, it's always, uh, always fun trying to get those three.
Kylie Davis: We're at an interesting intersection at the moment, aren't we, in technology, and PropTech especially, in that a lot of the data that we need to go forward hasn't been captured yet, and we're in this, we're in this sort of gray period where why don't the banks know about all of their portfolios, or why don't social housing people know about all... I mean, well, it's kind of understandable because that information's been captured in forms which were put-
Alex Houlston: Yes
Kylie Davis: ... in filing cabinets in the past, right?
Alex Houlston: Yeah.
Kylie Davis: You know, like, if you've got a 20-year mortgage, that's... you definitely... it would've been probably on a piece of carbon paper.
Alex Houlston: Yep.
Kylie Davis: Um, like, this, this stuff goes way back. So, so working out how to convert all of that, um, static data into live data is, is kind of a big... And where it, where it resides to get it into digital formatting is-
Alex Houlston: Mm
Kylie Davis: ... um, is a big challenge. Um-
Alex Houlston: And it's split be- between, you know, a thousand organizations, so-
Kylie Davis: Yeah. Yeah. Awesome
Alex Houlston: ... ideally you'd have all the data from all the insurance companies and all the government agencies and everybody, but, uh-
Kylie Davis: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And well, even at council level, right? There's so much that councils do that is still very, very manual. Um-
Alex Houlston: Yeah
Kylie Davis: ... so yeah.
Alex Houlston: Or the rates data. Actually, um, yeah, I mean, valuation firms end up doing inspections for the rates.
Kylie Davis: Yes.
Alex Houlston: Um, which a lot of the time, you know, the councils... You would think the councils would be the place to get that data, but actually the contracts are usually from state governments. So yeah, very difficult to get a hold of that.
Kylie Davis: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep.
Alex Houlston: CSIRO is a great, a great example where from memory in the UK there's a sort of similar organization called the BRE, and, um, and yeah. I mean, most places, um, if it's g- uh, government funded, and therefore taxpayer funded, you would think the data should be made available to everybody. Um, and that's not the case with the CSIRO. It's, um-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... you know, it's run in a different way. So, um-
Kylie Davis: Yes
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, that data's also, you know, hard to get a hold of sometimes.
Kylie Davis: Yeah, yeah. And there is, what, 500 and... I can't remember. I do have the number somewhere. 526, 538, something like that, councils across Australia, so-
Alex Houlston: Sounds about right.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. So much digitization to still be done. What do you see the next... What are the... What do you see your next couple of years of challenges are gonna be, or what are your, uh, benchmarks that you're, that you're target- that you're aiming at?
Alex Houlston: Um, yeah, for us it's scaling up. Um-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... so, um, yeah, basically building the machine, for a better way of describing it.
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm.
Alex Houlston: Um, so, you know, as, um, as with most startups, um, you know, a lot of the processes have been quite reliant on the founders.
Kylie Davis: Mm.
Alex Houlston: Um, yeah, the, the platform now automates end to end, but there are always bits that, um, yeah, filled in or, um, or aren't as automated as we would like. So again, there are processes around that. So, um, particularly, um, yeah, particularly in the, uh, procurement part, that kinda middle part, you know, there's some document libraries, that sort of thing that, um, yeah, that need to be part of the platform rather than being made available, um, offline.
Kylie Davis: Mm.
Alex Houlston: A tiny example, but it's one of those, um, yeah, b- The machine, as in, you know, software as a service with the marketplace needs to be, um, no manual processes. And then, you know, the other parts of course would be the team- Machine, as in, you know, um, not being reliant on particular individual's knowledge or IP and, you know, making that available, um, via the team as a whole. And, um, so yeah, we're working through with advisors and, um, and investors about, um, about which parts we, we focus on most, which are most valuable. And, um, yeah, that's clearly the, the marketplace element. Um, but also, yeah, automating the procurement into our, our monitoring and verification. So the monitoring and reporting based on the UN IFI standard. I'm not the person to talk about that, but, um-
Kylie Davis: Mm-hmm
Alex Houlston: ... um, but, um, yeah, that's so that reporting. And the first customer actually that will have, um, full access to aggregated reporting across their portfolio is actually the ABC. Um, the ABC use Boom for, um, assessing and procuring, and then monitoring and verifying solar across their portfolio. Just solar. It's probably the only one where it's, it is just solar and not electrification. Um, but, um, yeah, to date, they've procured about 16 systems across their 62 buildings and, um, yeah, they- they're a- aiming, I think, by the end of 2020... or middle of 2026 to have, um-
Kylie Davis: Fantastic
Alex Houlston: ... yeah, have done all those 66 buildings. And so we're gathering data from metering devices and inverters and, um, yeah, providing that snapshot at a sort of portfolio level of the impact they're having, and they're particularly interested in emissions.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. Fantastic. So Alex, do you think, you know, climate change and electrification and energy efficiency, these are kind of all key challenges at the moment that we need to get our brain around as a society? Do you think we're going to be able to, to do it and start to reverse some of the, the damage that we've done so far?
Alex Houlston: I'm a born optimist, Kylie, so yes.
Kylie Davis: Awesome. This is how PropTech saves the planet, right?
Alex Houlston: Yeah. Scope three emissions are the big one.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: You know, it's, um... Yeah, like scope one and two, where everybody's focused so far, um, it's not simple.
Kylie Davis: Tell me, what is a scope three emission? Tell me what the different scopes are just before we wrap up.
Alex Houlston: Well, so, um, so for your scope three emissions are, say, take a bank. Um, scope three emissions are those they have no control over, but they have an investment in.
Kylie Davis: Right.
Alex Houlston: So their mortgages. Yeah. You, you, a bank can't control how, um, when you- when and how you use your cooker to make coffee.
Kylie Davis: Yep.
Alex Houlston: And, um, probably for the best.
Kylie Davis: Yeah. It's got nothing to do with you, St. George, go away. Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Exactly. Um, and you wouldn't want them to ever-
Kylie Davis: No. No
Alex Houlston: ... to know what, what you're doing with your electricity or gas.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Um, but they have, um, they have financed your home or, um-
Kylie Davis: Mm.
Alex Houlston: So they have, um, they have influence in a way, and they have, um, the regulations coming in, um, will mean that they're gonna end up being responsible for those emissions and trying to reduce them.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: So, um, so for a bank, yeah, the mortgage loan book and their, their loans to businesses are going to end up being, you know, an order of magnitude larger than direct emissions. So scope one, where they have control within their own buildings, or scope two, where they're buying it from, or, you know, from the grid, say.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Because, you know, scope one, you can obviously retrofit your own properties.
Kylie Davis: Yeah.
Alex Houlston: Scope two, you can buy via a PPA, um-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... from the grid. But scope three, yeah, less influence, but-
Kylie Davis: Yeah
Alex Houlston: ... um, but much bigger scale.
Kylie Davis: Yeah, right. Got it. Thank you for that. Um, well look, Alex, it's been absolutely awesome talking to you today. Thank you so much.
Alex Houlston: You too.
Kylie Davis: Um, best of luck with Boom. It's, um, sounds like a fantastic, uh, PropTech, and looking forward to hearing more stories about your success.
Alex Houlston: Yeah. Thanks for having me, Kylie. Great to talk.
Kylie Davis: No worry. Thanks for being on the podcast. Now, what do you think about Boom? I love it, and I wish they had a direct-to-consumer platform 'cause I'd be all over it right now. I don't know about you, but my weekends are pretty full and my brain is usually fried from the week at work. And while I do desperately want to upgrade and improve our home's energy use, there is just so much to learn. But without taking the time to do all of that homework, you really are at risk of making an expensive mistake. And look, honestly, the last thing I wanna do on the weekend is research a whole lot of stuff online. I actually need to do things to ground myself. So a single platform that helps you pull it all together and understand all the elements in one spot is a huge asset. Big kudos to Australia Bank for getting on board with it. Maybe it's another reason why I should switch my mortgage. I don't know. Well done, Alex and the team at Boom. Good luck at getting a consumer platform up, and when you need a beta user, give me a call. Now, if you have enjoyed this episode of the PropTech Podcast, I would love you to tell all your friends or drop me a line either via email or LinkedIn or on our Facebook page. And you can follow this podcast on Spotify, Google Podcast, Anchor, and Apple iTunes and anywhere good podcasts are heard. I would like to thank my podcast producer, the fabulous Charlie Hollands, podcast website editors, Gil Escudero and Shira Sexison, and our sponsors. HID, digital identification solutions for your building. Direct Connect, making moving easy. Dynamic Methods, the name behind Forms Live, REI Forms Live, and Realworks. Easy Pay, making collecting payments easy for PropTechs. And the PropTech Association Australia, Australia's industry body which is supporting the flourishing PropTech community. Now, if you're an Australian or New Zealand PropTech who would like to be on the show, please drop me a line via LinkedIn or email kylie@proptechassociation.com.au. Thanks so much, everyone. Until next time, keep on PropTeching. Do you run a PropTech business or are you the founder of a PropTech? Make sure you join the PropTech Association of Australia. It's Australia's new not-for-profit association made up of tech people who are passionate about the property industry and committed to improving experiences in how we buy, sell, rent, manage, build, and finance property. Joining will give you access to events and networks across Australia and globally to help you promote and grow your business. Go to proptechassociation.com.au and follow the prompts to join.
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